Is this wrong?

[Silverado05]

Ok before anyone jumps me I know this is not morally right, but what this guy is doing isn't right etheir. I have this mod I purchased for my phpBB forum (yes I know I had to purchase a mod, first mistake). Anyways, he is offering the old releases for free but they are full of bugs. In order to get the latestest verions you have to Dontate, not buy, dontate mind you and that is how it's worded. Not only is it $15 which is outragous for a script of this cailber and for a mod that is not even that code intensive. I mean hell, you can purcahse a entire CMS portal system for less. So I broke down and donated the $15 so I can get a fix. Come to find out this donated release is full of bugs and doesn't work correctly etheir. I posted my issue on his support forum. He talked all high and mighty about him offering support for this script on phpBB forum and he has recieved a lot of hell for what he is asking for this script. He said it was for his time and because of the support he is offering. Ok I get the upgraded verison installed and it's full of bugs. I post on his forum and it goes a week without being answer. Mine isn't the only one going unawsered. Not so much as a "I will look into this and get back to you". So after a week I replied to it with "Stil biding..." and he banned me saying I was disrepectful and inpatient. Even after all that he still failed to support the script so I filed for a refund from pay-pal and that ticked him off. I told him it was because I paid for a script that doesn't work and is full of bugs and you won't support it. So I told him if he didn't support it that I was going to release it free of charge in order to get support for it. Now it is released under GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE and it clearly states that all in this file. Now I know I am legally protected by the GNU if I want to offer the "Doanted" script mind you for free. So what I want to know is if what I am doing right and would anyone else do the same since he is falling to offer support after I made a required donation? He is threating to sue me If I release it which I am not scared because this guy is obvisiouly a kid. I just laughed as he clearly has no understand of what the GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE means. Also not to metion he lives in the UK and I am in the U.S. so I doubt he has the time or money to come to the U.S. for a civil suit not to mention he doesn't have a case anyways. So would anyone else release this since he is failing to support it? It says on his site it's a free download anyways and that he accepts donations, not payment. But yet in order to get bug fixes you are required to dontated to get them. What would everyone else do?


-Thanks

[WebJDC]

first off i dont quite understand your question...

umm i would not have bought the mod, phpbb is a free software, and there are plenty, and i meant almost all mods for it are free also.

second your right in wanting your money back...

third, he is going to sue you over 15 dollars? let him.

[Silverado05]

Yea I didn't want to buy it etheir and trust me he has been getting a lot of crap on the phpBB forum for charging for this mod. Espeically charging $15 for it at that. In order to get the update and bug fixes I was require to donate to get them unless I wanted to wait for the donated version to become available for free. Their was no telling when that would be.

No I told him If he wasn't going to support his script then I was going to release the donated verison for free to the public in order to get it supported. He said he would sue me for copyright, theft and blackmail. I laughed as, 1. It was release under GNU so it's not against copyright and I am not releasing it as orginal material. GNU allows me to redistrubt it. 2. He send me the code for the donated download so no theft there as that's negligence on his part. 3. That can't be blackmail since I never threated his life or family or threatened him with extortion. I know this kid is full of it so I don't wory about his idle threats as I know the GNU and I have been in web programming for 11 yrs.

What I want to know is if I would be in the right to offer this package for free where he is asking for a donation for it. Since he did screw me and others over I think that would be the only fair thing to do in order to get support for the script and under the GNU allows that. Also to stop him from getting money on this script and scamming others.

-Thanks

[siguie]

If it was released under the GNU license then go ahead and distribute it!

If you made a "donation" it's a bit squishy whether you should really get the money back ... though it seems pretty obvious that it was a "charge for product or service".


Anyhow if you do release it ... why not create an anonymous account on phpBB (go through a proxy server) then post the code and be sure to include the GNU agreement as it is found in the code or attached file so that it's "complete" as per the license.

Oh and keep in mind that version 3 "Olympus" is coming out soon and all of the mods and most of the templates will be worthless soon.

[Silverado05]

Thank you, yea I have been banned over ther at phpBB. Those guys are morons over there. I was accessing it through this one proxy but it has been password protected so I can't get into it now. How do I set up a proxy server? I am just not real familiar with them.

This will work with phpBB3 when it does come out because it doesn't effect any of the main code. This mod intergrates into it. This is the instant messenger mod if you are familiar with it. If not it has it's own files.

Alot of people have been telling him that he is charging for this and not asking for Donations and that it's wrong. I am just trired of this guy scamming everyone so I want him to get what he deserves. Yea it's released under the GNU and has all the docs in the package plain as day. I only got my money back though when he banned me from his forum and failed to offer support for a script I donated for and it didn't work. The way I look at it is, no working script or support, no donation. Which as you said, was more of a charge anyways.

-Thanks

[Dustin]

I've read alot of articles on this type of issue over time, I do know that in court forced donations to receive products or coding will stand up in court as a charge for the product or service rather than a free donation.

But this guy must have nothing to do in his free time if spending hours in court is worth 15$ to him.

[Silverado05]

Yea I agree, what is it though. In the U.S. it has to be over a $20 or is it $40 in vaule to sue over? Regardless, it's only $15 so he still couldn't do anything and it would cost him more to fly to the states to pursue this then what he would get. That's why I just laughed cause he obvisouly doesn't know what the GNU he released the script under means. I think his main concern is I am going to freely release the "Charge/Donated" verison to the public. I told him sorry, if you don't support it. I'll have to get it somewhere else and since you released it under GNU I am legally able to do that.

[PhreakPhy]

Because it was a "donation" I dont think you have any right to get your money back.

But this GPL software he is selling, distribute it to the comunity and have them fix the code. That is what open source is all about. And make sure to get enough visability to put him out of buisness.

[Silverado05]

If I had a way to get onto the phpBB forum I would post it.

Yea I understand it's not morally right to get my donation back, but it was required in order to get this verison. Also I thought I was donating for a working script and for the additional support which he claimed donated members got. Also on is site it says free download. If anyone wants to post this on the phpBB forum for me I will give them the file to do so. Unless someone can tell me how to set up a proxy to access it.

-Thanks

[String.Parse]

as I know the GNU and I have been in web programming for 11 yrs.

11 years?.. umm, then why are you not writing your own scripts?

[Silverado05]

Why write one if it's already been done and I don't have to? Do you like to do things the hard way? I have to much on my plate then to write mods for phpBB forums. Since I install phpBB for clients all the time. I like to know what mods are available and how the work so I can offer them in case they are looking for something like that. So why do extra work when you don't have to? That's like reinventing the wheel, doesn't much sense does it? How does your question add anything to the topic at hand?

[String.Parse]

Why write one if it's already been done and I don't have to? Do you like to do things the hard way?

It seems the "hard way" is the way you've choose... I'll write a 54 line script long before Ill give a kid 15$ for the same...

[Silverado05]

Explain to me how it was the "hard way"? If I could predict the future and had I known this would happen then I would be rich right now because I would have won the lottery by now.

Like I said, I don't have the time to sit and reinvent the wheel when something like this has already been done. I don't like and should not have to buy mods for phpBB and I strongly agree with that. It's not like I went right out and purchased it? I used the free older released verison for several months before I brokedown and donated for the upgraded verison. It's not $15 is going to break my bank, but it's the principle of the thing where I should not have to pay for it to begin with. Besides it's more then just a 54 line script. It would take several weeks for me and others to write something like this and beta it when I simply do not have the time for something like that right now. I have other paying projects that need my attention.

I still don't see how your posts are relavant to my thread and the question at hand? If you do not have anything vaulable to add besides questioning my choices and ablilty then please save your replies for else where.

-Thanks

[mini]

Yea I agree, what is it though. In the U.S. it has to be over a $20 or is it $40 in vaule to sue over? Regardless, it's only $15 so he still couldn't do anything and it would cost him more to fly to the states to pursue this then what he would get. That's why I just laughed cause he obvisouly doesn't know what the GNU he released the script under means. I think his main concern is I am going to freely release the "Charge/Donated" verison to the public. I told him sorry, if you don't support it. I'll have to get it somewhere else and since you released it under GNU I am legally able to do that.


Just so you know, He would sue you in the UK & you would have to go there & defend yourself, otherwise you can get convicted in "absentia".
The jurisdiction of the case is based on the plantiffs location, not the defendant's.

(not that he will sue, cuz you can't sue for loss of dontations!)

[Silverado05]

True, he could try but international laws would protect me from that every happening. Espeically since it's civil and not criminal. You bring up a good point though. I don't know how the UK judical system works, but he would have to havee me served which would entitled him having to pay a fortune for someone to come do that. I know he doesn't have the time ro money to sue over $15.

What I would really like to know is if anyone else would release this to the public regardless if it is a payed or "donated" verison?

[1darkangel]

I am not sure if I would release it or just let it go to tell you the truth. BUT if you do decide to release it just make sure to keep all his documentation (if he has included much in the line of that sort of thing) untouched and make sure the GNU GENERAL PUBLIC LICENSE is also included with it.

I wish you the best in all this and hope it settles down fast.