Bluehost's New "Site Backup & Restore"

[JND]

I don't know how many other shared environments are using this thing, or how many of you have noticed the change, but our "old" cPanel backup utility has been removed in favor of what seems like just another nickel and dime promotion by Bluehost.

Our backup utility now contains "free" and "paid" varieties of backups. Well, at least my backup utility does. And I absolutely and quite adamantly refuse to pay BH a single additional penny for the "privilege" of my backing up and saving my files.

It wasn't enough to litter cPanel with "promotional" ads in every nook and cranny. Now, we're being asked to pay for a "pro" version of site backup? And one that uses web-based HTTP downloading of these compressed files to boot?

So now, the only way to obtain a CURRENT database backup is via phpMyAdmin. Unless you want one of their "courtesy" backups dated whenever. Now this might not seem like a big deal to those with static HTML sites, but with most sites today built using PHP containing forums and galleries, this is a MAJOR annoyance and PITA. No more may I decide to work on my site and initiate a backup current to this moment that contains all files from the shared root. No. Now, I must either FTP from the web root and head over to phpMyAdmin for the corresponding database(s) and HOPE they match.

BH has turned a simple one click operation into a promotional fee-based project I for one don't have time for, and don't at all appreciate. Methinks it's time to start looking again.

[dwwright]

I completely agree with you...complete crap on BH's part. Not one notification mail from them about this change. It's not that I can't adapt, but to just change something without courtesy of letting your customers know?

[JND]

That's not the extent of it. There are other issues as well. For example, "Backup" is a basic and integral part of cPanel. It's one of the tools we, who have used cPanel over the years have grown accustomed to using. Without having the carrot of spending more money dangling before our eyes. Further, with so many BH specific changes to cPanel, it should be renamed and reformatted to something along the lines of bPanel because this is NOT the cPanel that has been designed and developed by J. Nick Koston, and this is NOT the cPanel that exists and is offered almost everywhere else.

I don't know how long this topic will last here, because usually, any topic that comes remotely close to user-opposition or dissatisfaction is met with a lock, censorship or removal. Or some nonsense about how this is a "user to user" forum and nobody here can help. Well that's not true. Everyone here can help. If you agree with me, contact BH support and register your complaint. Link this thread if necessary.

Here's an excerpt of my response from BH support. I have highlighted the word "nearly":


We understand not wanting to pay for additional tools but with this you can still do nearly everything as before and then with the upgrade, a lot more.

I will pass along to our developers your specific issues and that you are upset with this change so that they may be able to modify this if enough individuals still want that ability (to create an instant back up).

Come on, folks. Let BH know what you think of this. "Nearly" isn't nearly enough. And it's almost unfathomable to think we have to fight for a basic tool included in cPanel.

[JND]

I completely agree with you...complete crap on BH's part. Not one notification mail from them about this change. It's not that I can't adapt, but to just change something without courtesy of letting your customers know?

Additionally, the fact (or what seems) that you came here as a guest and registered (then replied) possibly intending to find more information on this particular issue speaks volumes. I hope enough of you, current members and guests alike do the same.

I'm not anti-bluehost. I'm actually content with their service. I am however, anti-nickel-and-dime users to death, and anti-unnecessary change. If BH wants to do the right thing, offer both. Give me back my backup tool. Give me the option to decide what's best for me.

[farcaster]

I took a look at this new backup this morning. It appears that all of the free parts are still there - grab a full system backup for instance. That part costs nothing and is part of the basic package. And yes, the part about creating an instant backup has been removed for some reason. But it looks like Bluehost now generates backups for everyone, which is a step in the right direction. That takes part of the burden off the account owners that never bothered to generate one, and then wonder why they can't restore their site.

The backup that was automatically generated (I downloaded the one available for me) is identical to the one that used to be generated on demand by us. So everything is still there, free to use. Yes - there are some options for pay for those that want to take advantage - that automatically restore the site. Before that we had to know how to extract the tar package and find what was needed and then upload that back to the proper place, or rebuild a database. I'm sure that there will be some/many who welcome the option at a fairly low price.

I did find one part that I find really bad. That's the forced download of the backup via http now. I would rather have a choice to get a pointer/path to the backup and use (s)ftp to retrieve it. I examine my account with the File Manager and couldn't find the backup anywhere, so it must be in a place that can't be accessed other than through the backup application. Also the load placed on the browser/http connection is horrible, and I found that doing anything else during the download was real, real slow - even visiting a simple site like google.

So if enough people start asking for a different method to download they will listen. And maybe they will also listen to those who want to use the older method of backups.

[JND]

The backup that is automatically generated is not a current, up-to-date immediate backup of what exists on the server at this moment. This is unimportant to static HTML sites, as I have said already. It is paramount to those of us who employ database driven PHP sites that will always be more current than our own backups due to the nature of real-time data writing by guests, visitors and members.

I have a backup from this morning. Should a member decide to upload some photographs, then tell a story in the forum, I have no backup of it. And I can no longer click one button and grab it -- via FTP to boot!!

There is no full home directory backup tool in place today that allows me to download my SQL databases and web files (in one place) as they exist right now.

The HTTP method is absolutely awful. The file is not stored within our reach, which means FTP is no longer an option.

So technically, ALL of the free parts are not there. You can NOT use this backup tool to obtain a current copy of your mySQL databases. And woe are the folks who use Postgre, for they must now pay $13 a month or use phpMyAdmin (or PostgreSQL export). And speaking of phpMyAdmin, that too will become useless (or is already useless) for those with very large databases. That means we all must either pay $13 monthly or grab Big Dump (or equivalent) -- out of sheer necessity based solely upon greed. Or live with an outdated "courtesy" backup dated.... whenever. And potentially lose all data written to the disk between any event and the current time.

This isn't asking for too much. If BH really needs my extra dollar per month, they need to find other ways to generate revenue. Don't pick my pocket while also denying me a basic tool everyone else has free of charge and free of inconvenience. This is an outrage.

[felgall]

Never having looked at all the backup options offered by BlueHost/cPanel I can't really comment on how that has changed. The only ones I have ever used are the ones that backed up the definition of my email accounts and I only ever ran those once when I first finished setting up the email accounts. So I can't really comment on what BlueHost has done but I can offer the alternative of how I handle backups which doesn't rely on the tools provided and which also doesn't cost anything.

I would never rely on any third party backups of my site. The process of handling your own backups is really simple and you don't need to use any tools from cPanel to be able to do it.

The master copy of the static part of my site is stored on my own computer and is copied to the web hosting as each change is made. The copy on the hosting of the static part doesn't need backing up as it is only a copy. If anything gets messed up I can re-copy it from the original master.

The dynamic part of my site (the database content) is automatically backed up on a regular basis by cron jobs that I set up on the hosting for that specific purpose which use mysqldump to create gzip files of specific tables in the database on the time intervals that I decided are suitable based on how frequently those particular tables get updated. Those files are then emailed to me so that I can then use the import option in mysqladmin running on my own computer to bring that part of the master copy of my site up to date. Apart from setting the userid, password, and databasename at the start of the script, there are only three statements needed to run each backup - one to specify the backup file name, one to create the command that will do the backup, and the third that does the system() call to run the command. I have the one job back up groups of tables separately so that the backup files that it creates are not too big. That job saves the backup files in a specific folder of my hosting where any method could be used to retrieve them (eg. SFTP), I just prefer to have a second job run a few minutes later that sends the files to me by email so as to save me the trouble of having to connect in and download them.

The following in a cron job would make a complete backup of a database into a dated gzip file :


$backupFile = '/home/example/backup/' . $dbase . date("Y-m-d") . '.gzip';
$command = "mysqldump --opt -hlocalhost -u$dbuser -p$dbpass $dbase | gzip > $backupFile";
system($command);

BlueHost doesn't allow large databases (a large database would require multiple dedicated database servers to handle it), I am not even sure that you'd be able to host a small database of a few hundred Gb on BlueHost, but if you have a tiny database rather than a microscopic one you can update those statements to process the tables separately or in groups so as to keep the files small enough to be able to reimport many of them directly with the import command in phpmyadmin without it going over the file size limits. The other alternative would be to use the mysql command from a command prompt (or from within a script) to do the restore for you - see http://php.about.com/od/learnmysql/ss/mysql_backup_2.htm for how that works.

The backup and restore options in mysql itself are so simple that they almost make the import/export options in phpMyAdmin look complicated in comparison (after all phpmyadmin only really caters for databases in the microscopic to tiny size range).

[JND]

Never having looked at all the backup options offered by BlueHost/cPanel I can't really comment on how that has changed.

Which is exactly and precisely the point of my post. Please don't take this issue and turn it into something it's not and/or something you have no experience with. It has GREATLY changed.

I'm not interested in jumping through hoops to perform a simple all-inclusive current and immediate backup of the home directory, my files and folders, my databases and my email data that can be accomplished with the click of a single button, now removed in favor of free and paid flavors of a third-party web-based backup utility that isn't even part of cPanel.

Your comments, while worthy for folks looking for alternate backup methods, are not a solution to this issue. I do not seek alternate backup methods. I seek the backup tool that comes as part of cPanel. Overnight, we had the rug pulled from under us, and if that doesn't bother you, simply don't contact BH. For those of us who are tired of being nickled and dimed everywhere throughout our ad-riddled cPanel, this is the "last straw".

Take a look at the cPanel offered from another hosting company and compare to your own. Note the lack of ad banners everywhere, the lack of "Partners", the lack of "Promotional", the lack of "SEO Tools" all of which contain links to third-party affiliates that generate revenue for BH. Or simply, "spam".

http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/652/cap0000018.th.jpg (http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/652/cap0000018.jpg)

http://img801.imageshack.us/img801/652/cap0000018.jpg


A cPanel without Postini?? Without "Spam Hammer"?? "Advanced Email Campaign"?? No Mozy?? On and on and on.... when is it enough??

One of the tools it does include, however, is the working link to root/frontend/x3/backup/index.html

That would be the link to "Backup". The backup we no longer have. The backup that didn't incur a fee for any additional button clicking. The backup that doesn't solicit a buck a month for using it to its full potential. The backup that has always been a core feature in cPanel. The backup we have a right to use, when a control panel is being advertised as "cPanel". The backup that allows an immediate compilation of what's currently on the server.

By the way, I'd like to correct myself. In a few instances within my last post, I errantly made reference to $13/month. I meant to say $13/year.

Again, I am NOT anti-BH. Just yesterday my account dropped dead and they needed to perform a file rebuild due to "simultaneous drive failures". I was offline for roughly 7 hours. I didn't come here to complain. Though I did come here to see if anyone else had complained.

My point is, backups are too important to play games with. Play games with "Postini", "Mozy" and whatever other ADDON they wish. Continue to pollute cPanel with ad after glimmering ad. Do all of this, but leave a basic and integral part of cPanel alone. What's next? A new file manager with free and paid flavors? A paid FTP utility? A dollar per database? What??

You folks accept this and there's no telling what will come next.

[farcaster]

This thread is becoming a bit to argumentive for the forum purpose that is either to ask for help with Bluehost or give assistance to those asking for help here. It has turned into a "The Sky Is Falling!" and a soapbox.

For that reason I am closing it.