Open Discussion on Email Providers

[Danny]

I want to open a discussion to better help us understand and help Matt see our point of views. I don’t want this to become a confrontation thread, but a positive outcome.

In reviewing some of the threads already posted, it is obvious that a lot of folks out their including me don’t care for Horde & Squirrel Mail. We all like to see both email programs dump. With that comes a big responsibility for the Bluehost team to struggle to find a happy medium. So let’s post some of our own wish list.

Remember this is a customer opinion post and not approved by Bluehost, so we are only expressing our views, but our views gives the Bluehost team ideas to better their service and satisfy us the customers.

Let’s get started. I like to see several options that may help some of us. For most customers who use 3rd part programs like Outlook Express, Incredible Mail, etc., the current email providers may be ok for them since they are not using the services as a Webmail. For those of you who want more a Web base email services with the perks then this is were we will post the suggestions. Giving your customer the option to choose is a good promotional tool, but what Webmail program is used, can hurt your business.

Google Apps for Your Domain

Google Apps is a possible solution for most, but I like to hear from the Matt on what he thinks. We can choose who ever we want to set up an email delivery and go outside Bluehost, I have to wonder if this is smart thing to do changing MX records. Is this service replicable and does it meet our goals? Click here (https://www.google.com/a/)to review Google services. You can choose any combination of these Google services to allow you customers to interact. Now depending on your site may dictate what you want to offer them. Has anyone use this service with success and has your customer share positive feedback?

Everyone.Net

Click here (http://www.everyone.net/group-email-account.html)to view their webpage. Everyone.net is a paid service and you can choose from several packages. For those who don’t minding the cost and depending on your options then this may be an option for you to review.

Personal I am reviewing both these avenues and going to have to make a decision base on my research and your input. I want to give my customers a robust Webmail provider and other options to booth, but I want to give it the feel of my hosting not a 3rd party. Unfortunate I may have to be somewhat flexible and offer additional services. If these are selling ideas and approved by Bluehost, then maybe they should be listed under the Cpanel in the Partners / Promotional category. At least this would give Bluehost seal of approval for 3rd party programs. But I don’t speak for Bluehost decision making.

Any other ideas or suggestion?

[dreck]

Thanks Danny for starting this thread.

I like to say I don't have an ideas. I can say I have been researching several different webmail clients over the past few days.

roundcube.net - Very easy to install, & very simple & clean. But, just doesn't have some of the options I would like to see without lots of addons. Plus, doesn't support more than one account without forwarding.

google apps - Very nice, lots of options, & maybe what I end up doing? But, I don't want to have to change my mx records. I feel like for in the future, I want to keep all my eggs in one basket.

I was going to checkout yahoo, but I assume it will be just like google, I will have to change mx records. ?

This leaves me with third party software. I would not mind paying for a third party if:

1. The price is not to high. I feel anything over $100.00 for a license is out of my price range.

2. I don't want to purchase a software that has to be renewed every year. Or is going to cost me for every security update.

3. I want the software to do what I want, when I want to do it.

This leaves me to believe that I may not find what I want.... :(


I am with Danny, I would like to get some feedback from bluehost & anyone that has an ideas.


Thank you,

dreck
Stuart Simpson

[dreck]

Also, has anyone upgrade to the lastest verison of Squirrel Mail? I noticed the lastest version has alot of options that our current version does not have.
I may look into an upgrade..

[terrakeramik]

I noticed the lastest version has alot of options that our current version does not have.

would you let us know what you think and how to upgrade?

also does horde have a newer version than what BH has deployed?

thanks!

[Danny]

I'm sure Bluehost is using the most stable versions of Horde & Squirrel Mail and I don't think you personally can update either one yourself. Both are a package with Bluehost and not any option like the Fantastico provides.

As for Yahoo well it's a lot different than Google Apps. With Yahoo each of your email customers will also have a Yahoo account plus your email account for a price. Kind of redundant if you have to have your customers to have a Yahoo email address to read your hosting email. Unless I am wrong on this one, but what I research did not impress me. Yahoo has an excellent interface but lacks on providing you signal email address. Google will allow you to use your on account only and not have to have each customer sign up a Gmail account. Again if I am wrong on any of this please correct me, because I want to assure accurate information in this discussion.

:) Yahoo has the entire perk, but Google offers the better options of domain usage for free. Gee if we could combine both in to a new service for free we have our solution.

[DarkBeer]

I switched to Google hosted at the same time I switched my hosting service to BH. Changing an MX record is certainly not a big deal at all. You can change only one MX record within cpanel, which is how mine has been running. Based on the advice I read in another thread here, I have opened a helpdesk ticket to have the additional MX records entered, which the helpdesk said they would be glad to do. Other benefits on moving your email to Google include access to your mail even if your BH shared server is having "issues", and the ability to keep your email running if you decide to move your web hosting again. You also have the benefit of your mail storage not going against your disk usage at BH. I realize with the generous disk storage BH provides, this probably isn't much of a concern for most people.

I've been very pleased with the spam filtering at Google, and you also have a great webmail interface and the ability to POP your mail as well. I've yet to see a downside to the Google option.

[Danny]

DarkBeer

Google App seems to be the most popular choice and the way to go with and outside services. I like the idea that if something would happen to my website that my mail will continue to work.

For some of us to understand, what actually you had to do to change the Mx records? Just a brief idea when you go into BH Cpanel and want to make the changes. Also how long it took after you made the changes.

[DarkBeer]

Danny,
Go to cpanel
Click on email manager (under Site Management)
Click on Modify Mail Exchanger (MX Entry)
Click on Change an MX entry
enter ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM

Took less than a day for it to propogate the net.

I filed a request with the helpdesk and they added the other 6 MX records that Google provides. It isn't necessary, but I did it since it was available. The other MX entries are:
Priority Server
5 ALT2.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM.
5 ALT1.ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM.
10 ASPMX2.GOOGLEMAIL.COM.
10 ASPMX3.GOOGLEMAIL.COM.
10 ASPMX4.GOOGLEMAIL.COM.
10 ASPMX5.GOOGLEMAIL.COM.

[Danny]

One more question Darkbeer,

On entering ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM do you need to add the "." after the com like ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM. so that it will appropriate correctly?

[terrakeramik]

Could someone explain what would be the user experience of redirecting emails to a Gmail account. I have an ecommerce site, and it is important that my customers "receive" and "reply" to emails from mydomain.com and not to/from a Gmail account. Would this be invisible to my customers? Thanks for the explanation.

[DarkBeer]

Danny,
It is my understanding that the period needs to be on the end, although it doesn't show that way in cpanel. When I look up my host records from my Linux box, it does show a period on the end.

Terrakeramik,
The mail still maintains your domain name, not gmail.com, so it is invisible to your customers. You can continue to use whatever app based email program you use and/or google's webmail interface.

[Mr.Bacan]

I've installed RoundCube and it seems to be working excellent so far. I know it is still in alpha state, but isn't out there any more suitable e-mail client than Horde or SM?

[anthg]

I didn't realize until I started looking at some recent threads that some people have issue with the BH webmail.

I personally like Horde, for what it's worth.

thanks.

[Danny]

anthg,

If Horde suits your needs then that’s OK. It’s not an issue with Bluehost per say just that others want more for their customers on email. The issue is to use a 3rd party email service that will co-inside with Bluehost so the customer will not see a major change. If the customer uses Outlook Express or other software you install on your personal PC they will not see any major changes with any email service, in generally speaking the email service Bluehost offers will also work the same way. The thread post here is to help others use or find Email providers that can give more perks and use your on domain name for your hosting sites. Bluehost is an excellent service and one day they may be able to offer us more robust email, but I am afraid that will come with a price to upgrade a system like Google or Yahoo may provide. I for one support the upgrade if it would happen and pay and additional charge, but I’m sure it’s more complicated than that.

On another note this Post is more toward customers using a Webmail service with all the perks, plus the abilities to use the Email PC software. Each has their advantage. Webmail is becoming more users friendly on the internet and allowing using calendars, maps, chats, etc built into the service. Group email is another service out there and may work for some where not with others. Share calendars and address books work for one organization but not for an eCommerce site. Just depends on what each of us wants. We have the ability to turn some services off with Google or add others and for that Google Apps is in the lead for most of us. I don’t’ want to get to for ahead of myself here till I get a change to fully test Google Apps and see if it satisfies my needs.

We each have our likes or dislike for what ever service we use. Keep the ideas and comments coming.

[dreck]

I'm sure Bluehost is using the most stable versions of Horde & Squirrel Mail and I don't think you personally can update either one yourself. Both are a package with Bluehost and not any option like the Fantastico provides.I am not sure about the updating myself, but I believe I can? I have root access or did have at one time?
Squirrel Mail 1.4.9a was just released on dec 4th. Maybe we can get someone here at bluehost to upgrade for us? I would like to try it before I go & move my mx records.

I don't mind moving my records, but I haven't found a way to backup mail on google yet? This is very important to me.. even the great google can screw up!! ;) And I would hate for it to be at my expense.

dreck

[dreck]

MSN has the new Windows live. (live.com) It is in beta like most apps today. :) I changed over my msn account just a few minutes ago. Very nice, is a lot fast than the old hotmail I once used. It has alot of the new features & settings that could make it nice. But, doesn't have as many options as google. I couldn't find an import mail option? Maybe you can I looked for 20mins or so & didnt find it. And from what i can tell it doesn't support domains. So forwarding would be the only option. :(

I like it, & it maybe something I use for myself.

dreck

[Danny]

Dreck,

I did not find anything major different with MSN live v/s Hotmail. MSN is Hotmail no matter what they call themselves. They are not high on my list these days, but maybe they just trying catch up with times. They show not signs of a user domain offer where you can use your own domain name and not have a hotmail account? I may be missing something there.

As for Squirrel upgrading their service as of Dec 4th, well that not that long ago and make take time for Bluehost to upgrade their side. Patients Grasshopper it will come if it’s worth the change.

Again keep looking, I ‘m now setting up Google, I had my MX records change today and it seem to only take a few hours. So I let everyone know what I think of it.

[dreck]

Patients Grasshopper it will come if it’s worth the change.
hehe.. ah, im not in any hurry. I think most of the fun for me is the testing! :D

[free2001]

Sponsored Mail by everyone.net is a ton of ads. I think I even got popups and spy software from it. I have no proof and that was a few years back so I might be wrong but I know I hated them and left very quick.

[Danny]

Free2001

Advertisment from Everyone.net
Sponsored Mail is an advertising-supported solution so there’s no cost to you or the end user. Only quality ads are shown........

Sponsor Mail is an advertisement type email account from reading the information on the website. As for any of these sites you going to have some type of ads unless you find a hosting that will only provide you an email service like Microsoft Outlook Exchange, but that come at a hefty price. So you can say for those of us with little to no revenue we have to search for what is best for our needs.

Google Apps is no different in providing you with a hosting (FREE) service for a price. They get more from you by you using their product services with their site. Remember Google Apps is a beta, so no telling in the future if it will not become paid services. I guess again is personal preference for you customers and how much you want to be flexible. You also looking for a dependable secure email provider so 3rd party email providers play an important part of you site. Remember there is nothing for FREE in this world no matter how good it sounds, there is always a catch.

[dreck]

http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/officelive/FX101534261033.aspx?xid=mcrssaub0050004053mrt

I guess microsoft is offering something simular. I havent studied up yet but I cam across this & figured I share.

I have things to do today, maybe I can sign up this evening & get back to everyone with more info.

dreck

[Danny]

Currently I change my MX records to point to Googles Apps like DarkBeer explained in post 8 with only changing my ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM. and not worring about the other changes on the other records. My email working find with Google.

Second inside my Manage my site in the Google Cpanel I am setting up my URL to reflect my own domain for example http://mail.cajunfolk.com instead of http://google.com/hosted/cajunfolk.com. I also setting up calendar and start page. I will follow up on the outcome in a few days. I setup 3 separate subdomain in the Bluehost control panel and then open a ticket explaining I needed to change the CName for the 3 domain to the info Google requested. Bluehost confirm they can do it and I am waiting for the setup now so this is my stopping point for the moment. The rest of the story to follow soon.

Busy day yesterday and going fishing this morning. I have to be at work for my 14 days in the Gulf Monday, so I will get time to work out the kinks in Google APPS. So far it looks good for my purpose.

If anyone wills still be interested, I will leave a detail summary once I completed.

[areidmtm]

Second inside my Manage my site in the Google Cpanel I am setting up my URL to reflect my own domain for example http://mail.cajunfolk.com instead of http://google.com/hosted/cajunfolk.com. I also setting up calendar and start page. I will follow up on the outcome in a few days. I setup 3 separate subdomain in the Bluehost control panel and then open a ticket explaining I needed to change the CName for the 3 domain to the info Google requested. Bluehost confirm they can do it and I am waiting for the setup now so this is my stopping point for the moment. The rest of the story to follow soon.

I found it A LOT easier to just set up a subdomain and then redirect it to that URL instead of having support change the CNAME. Essentially all the CNAME is doing is a redirect back to the original URL.

When I first saw that, I thought that the URL would keep the subdomain URL, but it does not. It is just redirected.

I had support do it and it took several hours for the domain to propagate, but with a subdomain, it was instant.

[espybro]

Currently I change my MX records to point to Googles Apps like DarkBeer explained in post 8 with only changing my ASPMX.L.GOOGLE.COM. and not worring about the other changes on the other records. My email working find with Google.
....


Certain!

Last days I have been test Google Apps very satisfactorily. It works very well with wemmail and Outlook.

Thank you very much to all by the information. ;)

[atma]

We have our email for our primary domain (the domain for our account) set for "Gmail for your domain" This is set in the MX record and works fine however if someone sends us an email via the "Contact Us" page in Joomla the email doesn't get to Gmail but gets returned. How can one set up Joomla or bluehost to route the emails correctly? We have tried the PHP mail function, the Sendmail and the SMTP Server options but to no avail. What am I missing here?
It would be really useful if someone could explain how mail generated internally by Joomla, or other applications, is routed when the MX record is set to Gmail.
Thanks Atma

[kai920]

I found it A LOT easier to just set up a subdomain and then redirect it to that URL instead of having support change the CNAME. Essentially all the CNAME is doing is a redirect back to the original URL.

When I first saw that, I thought that the URL would keep the subdomain URL, but it does not. It is just redirected.

areidmtm - Could you give brief instructions on how to do this?


We have our email for our primary domain (the domain for our account) set for "Gmail for your domain" This is set in the MX record and works fine however if someone sends us an email via the "Contact Us" page in Joomla the email doesn't get to Gmail but gets returned. How can one set up Joomla or bluehost to route the emails correctly? We have tried the PHP mail function, the Sendmail and the SMTP Server options but to no avail. What am I missing here?
It would be really useful if someone could explain how mail generated internally by Joomla, or other applications, is routed when the MX record is set to Gmail.
Thanks Atma
Did you figure out how to fix this? I am trying to setup Joomla and have the same problem as you.

[Ferdinand]

Recently I switched my personal email to Google Apps, as well as our company email.

The reason for switching the company mail was twofold:
- we were flooded with spam and our filters where more and more overwhelmed by spam emails which cost us a lot of time to sort all the spam and non-spam.
- our website is hosted at and designed by a very small company using a CMS software. Therefore the company is controlling the access to the content as well to the emails (they set the passwords) and we had to contact them for every change concerning our email accounts.

Using Google Apps we solved the two problems. Spam is reduced to almost zero with an extremely low rate of 'false positives' and we have the complete control about the access to our email accounts and setting up a new account is done within 60 seconds.
:)

[pengyou]

I have skimmed the posts, not read all in detail..i was just thinking that if you really want to address this topic you might want to approach it from another point. Rather than discussing options start with a very basic survey.

For example - what do you need in e-mail software?

- forwarding
- bulk forwarding
- attachments

What do you need in an addressbook?

- store multiple e-mail addresses
- store a photo
- link to a calender

etc. Consolidate this info from the survey and compare to what software is out there that will do this. Personally speaking, most e-mail software will do what I need. Some is a little more convenient than others...but what I really need, based on the kind of work that I do, is an addressbook with lots of fields and capabilities, that will synch with outlook

[icedancer]

Could someone explain what would be the user experience of redirecting emails to a Gmail account. I have an ecommerce site, and it is important that my customers "receive" and "reply" to emails from mydomain.com and not to/from a Gmail account. Would this be invisible to my customers? Thanks for the explanation.

I have been running two gmail for domain accounts since last August. They work very well. Google sorts 99% of the spam with only three false positives. If you use a client such as Outlook you don't even see the spam - it is filtered. I just could not abide the increasingly horrendous amount of spam in my email accounts with Bluehost.

The account allows you to set up a number of email accounts to send and reply from - with one designated as the default. Your email is to and from mydomain.com - not google.

The MX record change is simple - just follow googles directions. I only use one record without problems.